Saturday, March 11, 2006
A Baker's Dozen, 13 Brilliant Hall of Fame Caliber Pitchers Who'll Never Get There Do to Their Late-Starting Careers - Part II
Four more late-starting pitchers who were clearly Hall of Fame caliber.
MIKE CUELLAR - after appearing in 2 games as a 22 year old, Cuellar didn't get another chance to pitch in the majors until he was 27 years old. Even then , it took him another two years to really get his shot. He pitched mainly for the Astros and Orioles in his career, and once he did get established he was pretty good. He finished his career with a 185-130 record. His Winning percentage was .587. He pitched to 89% of the league ERA over his career, and he moved the teams he pitched for forward by .041. Cuellar's typical year was 17-12. Using that as a basis, if his career had started 5 years earlier, his lifetime record might have been something like 270-190. A record that would likely have gotten Cuellar into the Hall of Fame. (Once he established himself he went 36-32 (.529) over his first 3 full seasons.)
RON GUIDRY - a Yankee his whole career, Guidry was not allowed to establish himself as a major league pitcher until he was 26 years old. His career record is 170-91. A career winning percentage of .651, which puts Guidry 24th all-time on the active list, and 18th on the retired list, just behind Johnny Allen. Guidry pitched to just 81% of the league ERA over his career, and moved the Yankees forward .089, which is 13th on the retired list.
A typical Guidry year was 17-9. Using that as a basis, if his career had started when he was 22, his career record might have ended up something like 238-127. That would certainly have put him in the Hall of Fame. In 1978, Guidry had one of the greatest pitching seasons in baseball history. He was 25-3 that year, pitching to just 48% of the league ERA (park adjusted), with 16 complete games and 9 shut-outs. He won the season-ending playoff game against the Red Sox, and went on to win a playoff game against the Royals, and then pitched a complete game win over the Dodgers in the World Series. He was clearly the MVP that year, no matter who the writers voted for. Take out 1978, and Guidry still won 62% of his decisions. (Guidry's record over the first 3 full years of his career was 59-18.)
RAY KREMER - pitched his entire career for the Pirates from 1924-1933. Kremer did not make his major league debut until he was 31 years old. He went on to post a career record of 143-85. A winning percentage of .627. He pitched to 90% of the league ERA over his career, and moved the Pirates forward .063. A typical year for Kremer was 18-11. Using that as a basis, if he gotten started at 22, his career record might have been something like 309-184. Obviously, Hall of Fame caliber. (Kremer's record over his 1st three seasons was 55-24.)
SAM LEEVER - a Pirate his whole career from 1898-1910. Leever did not get his career going until he was 27 years old. He went on to post a career record of 195-100. A career winning percentage of .660, good for 17th place on the active list, and 14th on the retired list. He pitched to just 80% or the league ERA over his career, and move the Pirates forward by .041.
A typical Leever year was 16-8. Using that as a basis, his career record might have ended up something like 272-140, if he had been given the chance to pitch at age 22.
Leever pitched alongside Hall of Famers Jack Chesbro for 3 years (1900-1902), and Vic Willis for 4 years (1906-1909). It can certainly be argued that Leever was better than both of his Hall of Fame teammates. While Willis won more games than Leever, 248 to 195, his career winning percentage, .548, was well below Leever's .660. Chesbro won 3 more games than Leever, but his winning percentage, .600, was also much lower than Leever's. Leever's 80% of the league ERA was better than Willis' 86%, and much better than Chesbro's 93%. If Leever's career had just started a few years earlier he'd be in the Hall of Fame, and it is certainly not a stretch to say he should be in now. (Leever's record over his first 3 years was 50-41.)
MIKE CUELLAR - after appearing in 2 games as a 22 year old, Cuellar didn't get another chance to pitch in the majors until he was 27 years old. Even then , it took him another two years to really get his shot. He pitched mainly for the Astros and Orioles in his career, and once he did get established he was pretty good. He finished his career with a 185-130 record. His Winning percentage was .587. He pitched to 89% of the league ERA over his career, and he moved the teams he pitched for forward by .041. Cuellar's typical year was 17-12. Using that as a basis, if his career had started 5 years earlier, his lifetime record might have been something like 270-190. A record that would likely have gotten Cuellar into the Hall of Fame. (Once he established himself he went 36-32 (.529) over his first 3 full seasons.)
RON GUIDRY - a Yankee his whole career, Guidry was not allowed to establish himself as a major league pitcher until he was 26 years old. His career record is 170-91. A career winning percentage of .651, which puts Guidry 24th all-time on the active list, and 18th on the retired list, just behind Johnny Allen. Guidry pitched to just 81% of the league ERA over his career, and moved the Yankees forward .089, which is 13th on the retired list.
A typical Guidry year was 17-9. Using that as a basis, if his career had started when he was 22, his career record might have ended up something like 238-127. That would certainly have put him in the Hall of Fame. In 1978, Guidry had one of the greatest pitching seasons in baseball history. He was 25-3 that year, pitching to just 48% of the league ERA (park adjusted), with 16 complete games and 9 shut-outs. He won the season-ending playoff game against the Red Sox, and went on to win a playoff game against the Royals, and then pitched a complete game win over the Dodgers in the World Series. He was clearly the MVP that year, no matter who the writers voted for. Take out 1978, and Guidry still won 62% of his decisions. (Guidry's record over the first 3 full years of his career was 59-18.)
RAY KREMER - pitched his entire career for the Pirates from 1924-1933. Kremer did not make his major league debut until he was 31 years old. He went on to post a career record of 143-85. A winning percentage of .627. He pitched to 90% of the league ERA over his career, and moved the Pirates forward .063. A typical year for Kremer was 18-11. Using that as a basis, if he gotten started at 22, his career record might have been something like 309-184. Obviously, Hall of Fame caliber. (Kremer's record over his 1st three seasons was 55-24.)
SAM LEEVER - a Pirate his whole career from 1898-1910. Leever did not get his career going until he was 27 years old. He went on to post a career record of 195-100. A career winning percentage of .660, good for 17th place on the active list, and 14th on the retired list. He pitched to just 80% or the league ERA over his career, and move the Pirates forward by .041.
A typical Leever year was 16-8. Using that as a basis, his career record might have ended up something like 272-140, if he had been given the chance to pitch at age 22.
Leever pitched alongside Hall of Famers Jack Chesbro for 3 years (1900-1902), and Vic Willis for 4 years (1906-1909). It can certainly be argued that Leever was better than both of his Hall of Fame teammates. While Willis won more games than Leever, 248 to 195, his career winning percentage, .548, was well below Leever's .660. Chesbro won 3 more games than Leever, but his winning percentage, .600, was also much lower than Leever's. Leever's 80% of the league ERA was better than Willis' 86%, and much better than Chesbro's 93%. If Leever's career had just started a few years earlier he'd be in the Hall of Fame, and it is certainly not a stretch to say he should be in now. (Leever's record over his first 3 years was 50-41.)
